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Feds to assume control of Bastrop Co. fire; volunteer firemen turned away
EDITOR'S NOTE: While this story remains on the site for archival purposes, an updated version of this story is published in our Sept. 8 edition with more complete information. Please refer future comments to that story.
BASTROP — Firefighting-trained volunteers from around the state converged on Bastrop and Smithville Tuesday to lend a hand to the beleaguered local firefighters battling the Bastrop County Complex Fire — only to be sent away as federal officials arrived at the scene and took command, apparently because local officials never made a formal request for volunteers.
“We were at the station getting set up into strike teams, and this guy came up and said that the U.S. Forest Service had ‘assumed control of the situation, and that ‘If you don’t have a vehicle that squirts water, go home,’” said Gordon Greer of Kirbyville, who drove all night Monday to arrive in the town beset by the worst wildfire in Texas history. “You’ve got guys who had driven all night long from Corpus Christi and Brownsville on their own dime, and they turned them away. He was really a (bleep) about it.
“There was a whole line of beige cars that came in this morning, tinted windows and such,” Greer said.
A spokesperson with the U.S. National Interagency Incident Center, Jennifer Jones, confirmed that federal group of several different agencies would be assuming command in Bastrop County around 1 p.m. Tuesday, but had not done so when the firefighting volunteers were told to leave. April Saginor with the Texas Forest Service said her agency had not given any such order, to her knowledge, but promised to provide an update later in the day.
The question is apparently one of protocol, however.
The Bastrop County Office of Emergency Management announced via its Facebook account Tuesday afternoon that “Any fire mutual aid requests would always come through (and to) Local, State and National fire service and emergency leadership. This message sent as per Texas Fire Chiefs, TIFMAS, IAFC, USFA and FEMA. If you are a fire fighter wanting to volunteer you have to be activated by the National Forestry Service first.”
The Texas Forest Service issued a statement Tuesday evening that it is not requesting firefighters/retired firefighters to report to Central Texas.
"If a person wants to fight fire they can:
Several of the volunteers voiced their displeasure, however, at federal agents taking charge at the scene after appeals by Texas Gov. Rick Perry for federal aid following another series of wildfires earlier this year was turned down.
“They’re willing to sacrifice the lives of the people of Bastrop just so they can come in here and pull rank,” said Daniel Miller of Nederland, who had led a group of Texas Nationalist Movement members who were certified firefighters to Bastrop from the Beaumont area. Miller said he and several other members of the group would remain in the Bastrop area to aid with civilian relief efforts.
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That is the way they work. Feds hate working with volunteers because it makes their paperwork harder. They will contract with crews who have wildland "red cards" and a certification such as engine boss or sawyer. They fill their organizational chart with contracted crews who have done the paperwork in advance and have jumped through their hoops. They have a big book that has all of the different types resources that they need. They will use the federal crews first(USFS,BLM,tribal)then state, local government and private contractors. I know it sucks to be willing to give your efforts freely and be told that they don't need you. I've been there. I was the chief of a small combination fire department and after the first time we were tossed of a wildland fire (it was on tribal land), we got a contract before the next fire.
If you have a group such as the TNM who want to help beyond the initial attack and after Feds take over, get the paperwork from USFS or BLM or your state forestry, get everyone carded, and get organized. If you do not have engines or water tenders, you can be a hand crew. After knockdown, they use a lot of hand crews for mop-up and restoration. You can build a slide-in tank with pump to put in truck bed and three or four of you can be an engine crew. Two people can be a tender crew. The important thing is to get a contract in place at the start of the fire season.
Good luck.
Bob Shuttles
rshuttle87532@gmail.com
Mr. Shuttles I understand what you are saying, however when you have a fire like this and so many home being destroyed and so much land, it seem to me that the Feds. could handle things a little different. Now you have the loss of lives, more that 600 homes lost and unk acers. People in high places need to think before they act.... Now they can explain why they had to be loss of lives while they turned away willing help to fight these fires... God Bless these families.....
Rick Norton
Houston, Texas
rickeynorton@gmail.com
I signed it, lets see if they delete mine......
Mr. Norton, you are correct! Nothing like the fed government to come in and screw everything up, and make it harder for the volunteers whom have traveled from who knows where to help, just to be turned away. This Red Card crap just sounds like more union crap, and costs people homes and lives, just so some union thug gets to act like a big shot.
Jimmie Jones
As a Smithville volunteer firefighter, I can honestly say, we didn't send anyone away. We used everyone who came including some we probably shouldn't have. Apparently the orginazilational structure wasn't so organized, and as the fire approached our town, other county firefighters were at home, not knowing the fire was endandering lives and still consuming Bastrop County homes. And the US Forestry Service was as overwhelmed as we were. Thank all of you who came to our aid, whether you were able to participate or not.
John Summarell
Smithville, Taxas
jsummarell@hotmail.com
With all due respect, Mr. Shuttles, your response exemplfies what is WRONG with America today. You lay out a protocol that is wrapped neatly and tied with a bow of bureucratic BS as if when people's homes are burning and livestock are dying you have the LUXURY of turning away able bodied men who showed up because THEY CARE NOT BECAUSE IT'S THEIR JOB!
This type of thinking is stright out of Communism that discourages the ALL AMERICAN SPIRIT of INDEPENDENCE and SELF SACRIFICE.
I'd take a dozen true hearted men over ten thousand paid responders ANY DAY.
Catherine Crabill
I'm not a fire fighter, and live in NJ, but I have to say to Ms. Crabill - Right On!
She presents an absolutely dead-on accurate description of these A - - holes in government, who care more about paperwork than they do about lives and property lost! For too many years I've watched these idiots in suits making draconian rules which are totally unnecessary, and completely rearrange the way disasters are handled, simply because during 9/11 we had too many resources arrive from accross the nation and had, literally, no place to put them.
Prior to that we had a perfectly useful ICS in place, which was admittedly very much over taxed during that horrible disaster. However, after the Feds got hold of things and rewrote the book, it changed from a 50-page paperback to Gone With the Wind! And like that book - its been a mess ever since! Never, never NEVER let the federal government stick their nose in where it doesn't belong, because if you do you'll be like the man in the government hospital who has a heart attack, and the doctor comes along and asks him to fill out a 50-page requisition form in triplicate before they will give him CPR!
Greg MacDonald
30-year EMS volunteer
To have your neighbors, friends & hometown strangers come and offer to help you as your property goes down is a blessing not shown in any regulation or red tape. It comes down to power and money. The federal government folks cover themselves in regulation because of laws they pass. Bob said because of paperwork they don’t like working with volunteers. This is the most sickening thing I have ever read. Governments higher authority is apparent here and being reliant on the police for protection, insurance when things go wrong & government for jobs is what is wrong here. I read where federal agents cut the phone lines at a Louisiana police station to regulate outside calls, stopped food and water trucks from entering the flooded city and now they turn away firefighters when Bastrop burned. I heard on News-8 Austin a fireman say they saw grass fires around houses and later saw the same houses in ambers. Do you see the connection? When hundreds if not thousands of volunteers are available why not let them build dirt trenches or dirt firewalls. Bob's statement only solidifies what is wrong. I guarantee most people will accept it because of conditioning to accept big government regulation. I can only pray that commonsense and human ingenuity will outweigh the need for certification by a paid government official to fight the fires Bastrop and surrounding counties.
D.Holsonbake
dholsonbake@austin.rr.com
I really don't care who is in charge as long as they know what they are doing. Whoever sent our ready to help volunteers home is an idiot. If they need to be certified then find out who is certified and put them to work on the front line fighting the fire. If they aren't certified then put them to work doing other things that need to be done.
Our country and state where constructed of men and women volunteering to help in whatever capacity was needed in whatever situation we were in at the time. Needless to say, our "so called" government has taken it upon themselves to decide for you and I how we should live our lives. How we are suppose to think. What we are suppose to say and when we should say it. We have gone long enough letting the government pull us farther and farther away from our roots as Americans and as GOD fearing people. They say we have the right to do and say anything we want (as long as it's done or said their way).
This country was born on volunteers, freed by volunteers, and still today our armed forces that protect this great land are volunteers. Not to mention 10's of 1000's of people who still volunteer for anything and everything and are damn good at what they do.
TEXAS is the greatest state in the union and is filled with those who will not hesitate to help their neighbor in need whenever and wherever they are needed no matter what the cost.
When I look out there at the fires threatening my family, my home, my life, do you honestly believe that I would for one second turn down help to save it?? HELL NO !!!
My last statement to whomever is in charge of this situation... GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS, TAKE WHATEVER HELP YOU CAN GET AND GET THE FIRES PUT OUT.
Believe me when I say, there's not a soul here that will say a bad word about anyone who is doing their best to end these fires. So don't be afraid to take action. Get the job done with whatever means you have to and worry about the BS rules after our people are safe and their homes are secured.
ENRAGED at the people who have forgotten their forefathers and how our country has survived all these years.
Dan Johnson
Texas,USA
Thanks for all the comments on both sides of this issue, but as you can see, aside from Mr. Shuttles, none of them were signed and I have deleted them. We do not allow anonymous comments, please.
--Dave Mundy, General Manager
Hello Dave,
Sorry I didn't sign my attempt to help get the good word out,had I known it I would have. Just trying to help.
No issues, just would like someone to write an update like the one below currently circulating Face book. It will really help keep those potential helpers informed.
I make this request because I read in your article that volunteers have been turned away stating "unless you have a car that squirts water you should leave" has me thinking if you need fire trucks and the likes just say what you need and I will help pass it along.
sample currently circulating face Book: ATTENTION TEXAS AND SURROUNDING AREAS.. WE NEED FIREMEN!!!! Begging for retired and any fireman to call number to help. We were short 25 fireman last night. Cannot contain town of Bastrop, 35 miles away...fire is 16 miles long, 6 miles wide, jumped Colorado river, evacuated entire town and also neighborhood called Steiner ranch of 5500* PLEASE EVERYONE REPOST EVEN IF NOT IN TEXAS.. SOME OF YOUR FRIENDS MAY BE. HELP!! Call 512-978-1187 Please RE POST.
Drew Foster, concerned citizen.
Drew,
Concerning the FB post circulating. This was started by an unknown source. The number listed was for Austin Firefighters to call in for their availability for callback to the City of Austin on Sunday afternoon only. It was only for Austin Firefighters but it went viral and we had to disconnect it because we are still getting calls on that line. A twitter post also went viral with the phone number to our dispatch center which we cannot disconnect and we are still receiving calls from all over the nation from volunteers willing to help. If you have access to any of these posts please advise them to remove them, we are still busy enough that we don't need extra calls to contend with. Thank you for the assistance.
Lt. Rob Stephenson, Austin Fire Dispatch.
Thanks Lt! This is one of the concerns I tried to convey to BCOEM as soon as I realized they were using an uncontrolled, unvetted social networking system to manage what is probably the biggest disaster this area has seen, in a community where it is likely that *maybe* 40% are active Facebook/Twitter users, and probably less than 25% of those are experienced and trained in responsible communication. I urged them to put some controls in place, use FB to make standard announcements, with pointers to official references, and I used the discussion board feature to provide information about responsible social networking during crisis management. I was ignored, then as I began to complain since the concerns I had were becoming reality, my posts were deleted, then ultimately I was blocked from their page, (also unsubscribed from the notification) I'm going to take some time to cool off, but am going to pursue this issue in the community. I am requesting a copy of the Emergency Management Plan, and am going to encourage folks in the community to get engaged and be part of that plan. Thanks to you and your crew and the TREMENDOUS contributions to our area. I hope you can rest safely, soon.
Jan Jensen
Cedar Creek
Its people like Dave Mundy who help destroy free press in this nation leave peoples comments alone we dont need to know any body's name jerk bag commie. You must be under some stupid Gov. controlling the press In fact I bet you delete this comment just to hide your own stupidity and embarrassment and keep free Americans right to speak under your control your company should have you sent to the unemployment line with your communistic controlling BS. I will be watching you Dave Mundy and I do plan to file a complaint when you remove this article.
Signed Tony Gates
I know many pages where Dave Mundy cant stop my comments about him and the Gonzales cannon and I will be Daves worse night mare and the cannons also law suits coming for deleting my free right to speak in any public forum Dave should be removed from his job as he is very unprofessional by trying to control peoples rights to express there selfs.
Also Nobody cares to hear from Dave but who can delete his comments
signed Tony Gates
I just have one question? Who would you rather have fighting your fires--the feds or thousands of local Texans who actually CARE about their neighbors?
E Wally Kinney
Dripping Springs, Tx
The Texans.
This is idiotic Wally! Who cares from whence a firefighter hails? Does it really matter? US Forest Service, or Texas Redneck? What's it matter?
I'll bet you don't question where your Social Security check comes from? I'll bet you don't mind paying your doctor bill with Medicare dollars?
And the Dollars in your wallet? Are they Texas notes?
Robert, Friendswood, Texas (Born in Texas)
Right on Mr. Kinney!
It is sad that many Volunteers arrived to help our fellow Texans, and are turned away because of some formality BS... I almost went to help, however Monday Morning we had the same DRY NORTH WIND, and I felt that I should stay to protect my home area. (Though had Texas Forsetry Service activated my department, I was already starting to talk to my boss about some days off)
Someone replyed to your comment, calling you an idiot and not caring about Texans, or someone from Washington. HOwever this person fails to realize that when the feds arrived, they sent some of our boys home, and that was that many less on the fireline.
Jimmie Jones
South Texas
TEXANS!!! Every time.
Linda Gibson
Euless, TX
I agree with you all - it should not matter. These people are there to help their fellow Texas - the fellow American. We need more people like this. Not pencil pushers or union thugs who do nothing but stand around. We need action. These people are suffering.
My husband and I had our utility pole break off three weeks ago. My husband called 911 (we live in a rural subdivison) but he got out there and found the fire. Fortunetly it did not go into the trees. He had it pretty well contained by the time they got there and they helped to make sure there were no other sparks. And I thank God we have these volunteer guys around! They are our friends, our neighbors.
Where was I? Loading my dogs and what I had sitting on my couch because I have been so afraid of fire since the one on Father's Day near Plantersville.
Linda Gandy
College Station, TX
Submitted by Anonymous on September 6, 2011 - 2:44pm.
He commented anon, but put his name at the end. This is kinda odd.
Devin Thackery
Unfortunately, our website is not set up to require you to use your real name in a post, therefore we ask registered users to register under their own name and those posting anonymous comments to "sign" their posts with their real name (not "M.Mouse, Thomas Jefferson or Abraham Lincoln")
The policy was set by our board of directors. If you have the guts to post an opinion in public, you should have the guts to put your name on it.
--Dave Mundy, general manager
I guess the founding fathers were gutless when they signed the Federalist papers anonymously under the moniker of " Publius"?
Steve Lane, formerly of Marble Falls, Texas, now in Crossville, Tn.
Great comment Steve Dave just wants to control free speech.
Signed Tony Gates
Take a Pamprin and get off your period. You do not have a right to free speech on someone else's property, be it their lawn, their house or their website.
Peter Smith
I find it interesting that you had to delete the comments. If you had posted them I am sure that it would be surprising that the level of displeasure that ordinary citizens offer up was so strong. We DO NOT need the federal government mucking things up...... FEMA should get the &^%* out of Texas.
Jay Vee
Austin, Texas
We wouldn't be at all surprised Jay. We're among the citizens who are not very happy with our federal government. We're willing to put our names on our opinions.
--Dave Mundy, general manager
Every time you reply about an anon post, you bump a real post off the page. How about just deleting them. Very few people want to read your anon comment all day long.
Please, just delete them!!!
shows you how our government is always hard at work..padding there pockets ,they get PAID TO BE THERE,but all these guys that were a VOLUNTEER,AND ON THERE OWN TIME AWAY FROM THERE FAMILIES, PUTTING THERE LIVES AT RISK, got turned away.THEY WERE THERE TO HELP ALL THESE FOLKS, NOT GETTING ANYTHING FROM IT OTHER THAN THE SATISFACTION THAT THEY WERE HELPING A NEIGHBOR IN NEED.AND THERE COUNTRY. GOVERNMENT SUCKS..
PROUDLY SIGNED,
GERMAINE ABNEY
former texas resident.
I was here to read the comments. - Gary First